Transcript 0:00 Hey, we're Nick and Jack, hosts of The Best One Yet. Behind every episode, there's research, emails, spreadsheets, and our shared Google Doc, the Headline Hammer. 0:07 With Google Workspace with Gemini, Google's AI is built right into the premium versions of tools we already use, like Gmail, Docs, and Sheets. No new tools or extra logins, just personalized AI for the way we work. 0:18 That means less time on the work around the work, and more time finding the stories worth talking about. Get AI tools for work. Upgrade to Google Workspace with Gemini at goo.gle/workspacewithgemini. 0:30 That's goo.gle/workspacewithgemini. [musical jingle] Wheelhouse DNA. [upbeat music] Hi, everyone, my name is Boya Kolade. And I'm Chris Sawtelle. 0:45 And welcome to the Future Forecast, a podcast where we explore the intersection between business, technology, and entertainment. Today, we're looking ahead. 0:53 We're gonna talk about how concert ticket sales are in a lull, how online publications are gaming the system, and Apple's announcement about their use of AI. But first, let's catch up. Man. I, uh- [laughs] 1:08 I don't even wanna talk about it. [laughs] What do you think? Well, well, well for the, for the people at home, let, let, let... You wanna clue them in? Yeah, so, um, we've talked about it a bunch and speculated on this. 1:24 Paramount has had the most messy M&A process, and literally on the w- not even the one yard line, the one inch line, Shari Redstone goes, "Ah, just kidding." [laughs] That's exactly what she did. 1:39 And, uh, canceled the deal with, uh, Skydance acquiring Paramount. And, uh, now everyone is kinda like, "What happens next?" 1:48 I'm literally in one of our episodes specifically commenting on it, saying, "There's no way Dav- uh, uh, David Ellison lets this go. There's no way. He's not gonna let it go. He's gonna 2:02 tout the flag and make sure that this deal happens." Speculation is he might have let it go. So I had read that Shari had one more major demand, or kind of two, wrapped up into two. 2:16 There, there's been a lot about how because she's the controlling shareholder, a lot of the other shareholders would, would sue her. 2:24 And so she wanted to, one, be indemnified, and two, get a vote for those shareholders to approve the sale. So she wanted it to basically rest on them, and apparently David and Redbird wouldn't do that. 2:40 That's the speculation. There's probably gonna be a lot of hearsay, but- I think the lawyers don't let them do that. I'm curious if it was David or if Redbird says, "Hey, there's too much. 2:50 We'll find another, we'll do something else because it's too much." Yeah. In the same thing that I was reading though, the thought process was why not just give it to her? Like, you've gotten to this point. 3:04 And it actually might benefit you to have that done because one, it, it protects you a little bit more, less likelihood of, um, lawsuits, and, uh, it just makes it much smoother if you have the buy-in of everyone. 3:20 And if they say no, then like it probably wasn't gonna be worth it for you anyways. But yeah, I think, uh, the question is what happens to Paramount now? Yeah. What does happen to Paramount? 3:35 I mean, that, this is your alma mater we're talking about here. What do you think's gonna happen? Are they gonna be okay? I mean- Are they gonna go bankrupt? No, they're not gonna go bankrupt. 3:44 Headline, "Paramount Studios goes bankrupt." As- The place that wanted to make movies? As, as long as they have Survivor, uh, they'll be fine, and Star Trek. No, but I think, I think someone... 3:58 The question is does she even want to sell? Like, I feel like she's probably going through, I don't know, a bunch of emotional ups and downs right now. Um, 'cause honestly the stock went down after this news. 4:11 Like, it's just not boding [laughs] well for her and like the ecosystem. I think in this s- situation, Shari, I mean, I'm not even gonna pretend to know what she wants. 4:24 I, I do, what I, what I do think is just really weird is like, like in the news there's been like hundreds of people just coming out of the woodwork being like, "Well, I'll, I'll buy Paramount. I'll buy Paramount. 4:35 Like, here's my deal. Here's..." And it's just kind of maybe she was confused by that and felt like she might get better deals. But I actually, you know, as time went on feel Skydance would be a really great partner. 4:47 Like, he loves movies. He's worked with them for a long time. And we were talking about this, like wouldn't be surprised if it actually in a roundabout way comes back to Skydance. 4:57 [laughs] It could just be a negotiation tactic. Like, maybe they weren't gonna give her what she wanted, and so she's like, "All right, no." You're ruining my hot take. Oh, is that your hot take? 5:07 Well, then we can save it. [laughs] We can save it. All right, let's dive in here. Let's talk about concert ticket sales. They're taking a dip apparently. Uh, and not the kind where you go swimming. 5:21 [laughs] You like what I did there? Oh, man. Yeah, I'm- Oh, that was so good... I'm practicing my dad jokes. Anyways, 5:31 you might have heard our, uh, episode recently where we talked about how concertgoers are traveling overseas to see their favorite shows. 5:39 Uh, but now what we're hearing is that some of the last decade's biggest musical acts are not selling the amount of tickets they once were. Why is this happening? A couple reasons. One, ticket prices are higher. 5:55 The average ticket price, uh, to see a top 100 act is $123.25. Leading- To customers being more discerning about what musicians they might want to see. 6:08 Ticket prices are above the average to see even bigger acts like Bad Bunny, $290, Justin Timberlake, $216, Nicki Minaj, $149. There are a ton of musicians touring right now, and there's a lot of competition. 6:26 Here's a couple people that are affected before we really dive in. So J.Lo, she canceled her tour. The Black Keys are booking smaller venues. I'm actually not necessarily surprised there. 6:38 Troye Sivan, Charli XCX are doing fewer tour dates. Artists like Cardi B, Justin Timberlake, and Pink have been dealing with underperforming tours. 6:48 Coachella actually had the lowest ticket sales of the last decade, and in a weird way, Live Nation has reported record revenues in ticket sales. 6:59 So it seems like artists are struggling, but somehow the big brother is still winning. 7:06 When we, when I look at the list of who we're talking about, how do you discern from people showing up to acts and just not being as attached to that brand anymore, versus this being a sales pandemic, so to speak, or epidemic for music sales? 7:28 Because literally, like, four episodes ago, we were talking about the news... 7:35 We, we, we were talking about in the news cycle how Swifties were flying all the way from the US to Sweden and this- or Switzerland or Amsterdam. Mm-hmm. 7:46 And so I think for me, in reading this article and as, as we looked through the research on this one, it's not, I'm not debunking this. It's more me saying 7:56 similar to how audiences may very well be tired or not being able to continue to go to 8:03 every single artist's performance, I'm also super inundated with the news cycle telling me time and time again that there's another problem, there's another thing, or, like, something else is happening that's falling off the hinges. 8:17 Because I think it's just all clickbait. At what point do I believe what the news is telling? I don't know. And I mean, like, not to, like, go here. Well- But, like... I, I think, um, you know, you mentioned T. 8:29 Swift, and I think really what we're seeing is the maybe a class system- Yeah... coming to play- Yeah... when it comes to artists. And I think, you know, really what's happening is these people are 8:45 saving their money for that big show, that Taylor Swift show, that Beyoncé show, and I think there's, they're picking and choosing. It's like, it's not like a everyone's gonna win. 8:59 In my opinion, I feel like a lot of this has to do with economics, and people just don't need to see 100 shows a year. When you say economics, now, in, in what way? 9:11 In, in that, kinda what I was saying earlier, like, I have a finite amount of money to spend on concerts, and I'm gonna spend it on my favorite artists. J.Lo, 9:22 Justin, these people who are having issues selling out whatever size arena or stadium, just play the smaller venue, right? Maybe some of these acts need to go to Vegas, you know what I mean? 9:36 Like, play a smaller amount of shows, right, in a certain area and, and you can still make a lot of money. But I feel like they might n- just not be as popular as they feel like they are, in my opinion. 9:52 Or they were popular, they had a huge moment. They can't sustain the demand the same way they used to. And their team... 10:00 Uh, and then the question is, is their team programming these tours and then unintentionally setting their act up to fail? Well, probably, but I think there will be a course correction now that they're seeing this. 10:12 I think it might just be a return to common sense. Like, "Hey, Justin, like, you, you have a certain audience. It's been a while. 10:21 Why don't we start you on smaller tours, make sure that sells out, and then we'll do something else." Or we'll do something, like, innovative, like kinda what we've talked about with Kiss and ABBA. 10:31 Like, you know what I mean? Like, that, that's just how I would, would maybe adapt, because there's still money in concert touring, but they have to be really careful right now because ego, I, is a big play. 10:43 Like, have you seen recently there's been a couple Instagram stories of, like, artists who are playing to, like, no crowd? Um- No... I've s- I've seen that. 10:51 Like, uh, I can't remember which artist, but, like, a couple big artists and, like, people are using that against them. I mean, Jennifer Lopez, she's having a real hard go of it. 11:00 Let's talk for a second about how an artist builds their brand. A lot of the names, every single name on this list, aside from Troye Sivan and maybe Charli XCX, they're all household names at this point. 11:14 J.Lo, Justin Timberlake. I don't think Nicki's pla- done, done the Super Bowl, but J.Lo and Timberlake have played the Super Bowl. So I guess it is, like, J.Lo, you played the Super Bowl. 11:27 You now are, like, the biggest venue ever. 11:30 You don't wanna go backwards, so you wanna continue to, like, I think both for herself, but also as you build this brand or this notoriety and this aff- affinity to the, the sale- the ticket sales world, this is who I am. 11:44 This is how badly you want me. You're gonna buy me out for X amount, and I'm gonna negotiate having that much leverage. You go out to market to sell your tour, and now you're stuck with... 11:58 She did have a really good Netflix show. No, that, no- Or movie... that, that got, that bombed as well. Really? Oh, d- everyone talked about... Have you not seen the clips? I li- I liked it Ooh, boy. No Here's the thing. 12:11 Here's the thing Boy, no I like science fiction a lot But you're walking into a death trap right now I'm talking about Atlas on Netflix. You should just watch it. That movie got trashed as well, bro I don't care [laughs] 12:25 Ah. Yeah, whatever. Anyways, uh, J.Lo needs to step it up in the concert world, and apparently maybe in the movie and TV world. Uh, let's see what happens. 12:36 I think, I think it's gonna come down to how representation adapts. I love what you were saying about how J.Lo might expect to be what she was back in the day, but I think they should be shipping, "Hey, small 12:49 could actually also be powerful and big." So we should talk about something else happening in the world, the news, as in 13:01 The New York Times, Washington Post, et cetera, et cetera, they're using games to, quote-unquote, "game the system." So- Am I being manipulated? What do you mean? Is the news manipulating me? 13:15 Oh [laughs] I was like, "Wait, what's going on?" Are they gamifying the news? [laughs] Well, this is how they're gaming the system. 13:23 Uh, essentially these online publications and sites are incorporating more and more games and puzzles into their subscription models. So we, we know, I mean we've grown up, right? Remember the newspaper? 13:36 That little thing? What? 13:37 [laughs] Uh, well, The New York Times, um, they actually, until World War II when there was like so much depressing news, they debuted the crossword puzzle in 1942, which really helped the sales of their newspaper, and it became a staple. 13:55 And over time, as we've seen, New York Times acquired Wordle. They've been incorporating other online games, 14:02 apparently to the point where they make more money on their non-news subscriptions than they do their actual news subscriptions. And there's a flurry of other media companies who are really following suit. 14:18 I always felt like I was, I was not in the know or not smart enough for the crossword puzzle. I'm more on the new age, like Wordle and Connections to- Oh, oh, got it. Yeah. You're, you're more of like a tech guy. 14:29 Yeah, I guess. Uh, here's where my mind goes, right? I, I don't think the ratio is public knowledge, but I latch, in everything about this, I latch onto this idea that games 14:45 drive more revenue than news, and I think about how other companies are doing this, uh, or maybe should do this. What is the future of online publishing? 15:00 Is it, are we going to look at gaming hand-in-hand with the, with the content that we read and see? And furthermore, can we apply this beyond news? Could, 15:15 in their own marketing and advertising, a company like Coca-Cola or Intel or even TurboTax play games, right? At least for me, what this article is highlighting is that the importance of surface, 15:33 surface meaning real estate. So I, average person that reads The New York Times, 15:44 I, I initially, my barrier to entry is going to The New York Times specifically 'cause I'm looking to gain information or to read how they architect stories that I should listen to and read and trust to be knowledgeable in my day-to-day life. 16:02 And yet, in my habit loop, all of a sudden I discover this really fun thing that is so difficult and so annoying because I am not smart enough to defeat it, the crossword puzzle. 16:17 And time and time again, I actually look more towards the crossword puzzle than I do the information that's actually in The New York Times. 16:26 And so that's why I ask about the time spent on the games versus the information because I remember there were so many times where like, it's like the funnies when you're a kid. How many times you never... 16:37 I, I don't know about you, but I would open up the newspaper. I didn't even care about anything else that was in there. I only wanted that. Yeah. So that surface was the most important thing. Yeah. 16:48 Did we, was it, was it on this pod that we were talking about streaks? That- Yes. So- Do, do you host another podcast? [laughs] No. But I'm trying to remember where we were talking about streaks. 17:00 Uh, in that we w- The, the essence of, of the takeaway of that conversation was this idea of gamification and the, the dopamine, the addiction that comes from finding success, and I feel like what you're talking about is, is what New York Times is playing into. 17:21 It's like, yeah, we're gonna get you with the news, right? Like, the journalism, the original content that you wanna see. 17:28 But what might be more powerful is getting you to come back every day for that dopamine hit so that you feel accomplished. So you know what's scary? What's scary? Take that 17:41 and apply that same math to the likes of Netflix getting into gaming. Hmm. We already get a dopamine effect. 17:48 If, if, we already get, we're not getting news, but we're getting information and, we're getting entertainment- Yep... by way of Netflix. Yeah. 17:56 But that dopamine effect that we get is still just very auto- it's just one, one to one. Mm-hmm. The minute you put gaming into it- Yep... we're, we're, we're gambling, baby. 18:08 And that's what I'm talking about, and I, I'm actually, I'm gonna internalize this myself, but like, I like how you married- 18:16 Sure, not just every company should get into gaming, but especially companies that have real estate, that have that, like, place that you might already be going to. 18:27 Like, adding some level of gamification can keep them coming back. Because this is the dangers... I mean, this ultimately is the dangers of corporations. Mm-hmm. 18:38 They have a price margin or they ha- they have, they have to answer to their board, or they have to answer to their stock price, right? 18:45 And ultimately, in order to continue to increase margins, you have to en- engage your users if you're, if you're a tech platform. 18:54 You have to con- con- uh, ensure that you are growing your margins, growing your user base, growing your audience, and, and maintaining them. And gamification is becoming more and more the, the solve- Yeah... to do it. 19:08 Maybe one day the crossword puzzle will be bigger than Fortnite. [static] [chiming] Hey, we're Nick and Jack, hosts of The Best One Yet. 19:19 Behind every episode, there's research, emails, spreadsheets, and our shared Google Doc, the Headline Hammer. 19:24 With Google Workspace with Gemini, Google's AI is built right into the premium versions of tools we already use, like Gmail, Docs, and Sheets. No new tools or extra logins, just personalized AI for the way we work. 19:35 That means less time on the work around the work, and more time finding the stories worth talking about. Get AI tools for work. Upgrade to Google Workspace with Gemini at goo.gle/workspacewithgemini. 19:47 That's goo.gle/workspacewithgemini. [chiming] All right. Here's the big one. Last but not least, Apple's AI debut. They came to prom, and they're the maybe the prom queen. 20:04 We'll see. So- [laughs]... Apple has revealed its plans to incorporate AI technology, uh, moving forward into its devices. And not just any AI technology. 20:15 They are partnering with OpenAI and are calling it Apple Intelligence. Here's what tasks it'll perform. 20:23 It'll proofread and suggest what users write in emails, notes, or text, prioritize messages and notifications, answer user questions, summarize audio recordings, check whether a rescheduled meeting would overlap with the user's family commitments, 20:38 so on and so forth. TLDR, the tech will focus on productivity and automation tasks with, quote-unquote, "broad appeal" while giving Siri more chatbot-like capabilities. So really what they're saying is they're just 20:55 boosting Siri. Uh, yes, but I, I think, I almost liken it to Copilot. I don't know if you saw the news with Microsoft Copilot, them integrating, um, AI into the Microsoft suite of tools. 21:08 Honestly, Google's already doing this. Like on, if you go on Google Word docs, there's like little bits of like added productivity where it like can predict what you might want to write, so on and so forth. I think 21:21 ultimately, I don't know. I don't know about this. I f- it just feels like Apple is borrowing the technology. I thought you said Apple was coming to prom. The queen was finally arriving. I said maybe. Oh, maybe. 21:36 You were letting it, leaving it to late- They're, they're coming to prom. They might be the prom queen. H- Here, okay, so let me rewind. Here- here's what I'm thinking. There's positives and negatives. 21:50 You remember when we were talking about Disney a while ago, and we were talking about how Disney isn't really like innovating? Yeah. One could say this is Apple not necessarily innovating. 22:02 I guess you could say the same thing about Microsoft, right? They're interested in AI. They're probably playing around with it. 22:07 But they're now working with maybe the next wave of the top tech companies in order to fulfill their interests and their needs. What do I mean by that? Before Apple partnered with OpenAI, Microsoft partnered with OpenAI. 22:24 Amazon's a really big investor in Anthropic. Elon is creating Grok. And Google has Bard. So Apple is really essentially the last company to plant their flag and say, "This is how we're going to leverage AI." And 22:42 at the same time, last does not necessarily mean least. They have, by way of iPhones, maybe the biggest distribution to the, 22:57 quote-unquote, "most desired class in audience," middle class to upper middle class. I would argue to say most of those people have iPhones, and I would also argue to say most of those people wouldn't touch AI 23:11 if it were not in their face through their devices, and that's what essentially Apple is providing with this news. 23:20 I guess my commentary to you is, is this reaffirming that OpenAI is just the be all end all, and their AI is so far ahead of the game that everyone else just needs to play ball and is not, not giving up, but just biding time so that they can 23:36 have their own proprietary AI catch up? Potentially. 23:40 You talk about innovation, and I think there's only so much innovation that can happen within the infrastructure of a company, and there's only so much one can do to innovate. And so once you be- become the big entity, 23:53 ins- in, it, when you become the big whale, you have the luxury of being able to maintain your business and identify others that you should acquire and merge into your, your overall umbrella. 24:05 Kind of like when we talked about Disney, you know, many, many moons ago, uh, looking at a strategic partnership with Epic. Similarly, is that what Apple is doing here with OpenAI? "Hey, you know what?" 24:18 We have Siri, but we don't have our own AI technology. Let's figure out how we can draft off of OpenAI, increase the story for Siri or Apple Intelligence, and I'm sure that they're the-- they got something to riff. 24:33 They have, they have some way to- Well, Siri, Siri is AI. She is. I, I, I'm in agreement with you. Yeah. She is AI. 24:39 I think you s- you said something that to me is the more profound question is, is OpenAI that much better? And I think here definitively the answer is yes, right? Because Apple didn't create their own technology, 24:57 and Google did, but Amazon's not. And I mean, again, they have to a degree in a more nascent way, right? 25:07 Amazon has Alexa, Apple has Siri, but there's something about these, these new fully focused AI companies where they're like, "Dang, we have to, like, actually invest in them." 25:19 Anyways, as far as OpenAI and Apple goes, it'll be interesting to see. I kinda get their move at the end of the day, but when I, when I think about this move, I think about, okay, 25:33 is Apple still an innovation workshop, right? Vision Pro is, okay, we'll see where it goes. They, they stopped the car. The sales of their new generations are slowing down. Where is the new product? Yeah. 25:48 And even now, this isn't a new product. This is us saying, "Hey, we're gonna, we're gonna connect and co-opt innovation from another business." Right. Well, we know it's not the Apple Vision Pro. 25:58 [laughs] Uh, so we'll, we'll see what happens, but I, I'm, I think Apple will still be a winner again because of the distribution that they have. But anyways, it's about that time. It is hot take time. Hot take time. 26:15 [air horn] [laughs] All right. I'm gonna let you go first 'cause I have some work, I'm still working on mine. Oh, you are? Yeah. You're letting it ruminate. Yeah. Percolate. Yeah. All right. Well, happily, uh, 26:32 I wanna make it e- fair and simple and easy. I still think that the Skydance-Paramount merger really could still h- be in play. 26:41 I think, uh, I think that Shari Redstone has showcased herself to be a master of the article leak, and I'm hoping for it. I really am. I think it'd be very cool to see that reemerge. 26:59 Let's see. I'm, I'm not counting it out. I'm not counting it out. That's, that's my, my hot take today. Shari gets what she wants, but David did s- already send a letter to his company. I don't know if you... 27:10 He, basically being like, "Hey, like, we're excited about the future ahead. Thanks for all of your hard work." It almost feels like he's conceded that they're not going to get the company. That very well could happen. 27:23 But that could also, I mean, those things get leaked. You're reading about it. You're literally talking about it. So then, like, that letter coming out, it's still kind of buffering. 27:31 What will be most interesting is the next two to, two to three weeks, right? Two weeks, we'll, we'll really know if this is or is not in the next two weeks. Mm-hmm. That, that's ultimately... 27:43 But I, I will not be erasing one of my marks, you know? Yeah. All right. My hot take is there's a lot of fun things going on. I'm gonna go with, with something around Roaring Kitty. So- Okay... 27:58 so as, as we've seen, Roaring Kitty has come back. What a name. [laughs] He's roared back into the scene, putting in, uh, huge amounts of money into GameStop. 28:12 I am predicting that he is going to get a slap on the wrist by regulation. Really? Yeah. I think it's gonna- On what terms though or on, on what, on what grounds? 28:27 I think, I, I, I think it's gonna be his enemies. I, I, I think it's gonna be the idea that he himself might be manipulating the stock, right? So, um, 28:43 you know, it, it, it'll be a full circle moment in that 28:48 his whole campaign has been, was against short sellers who had manipulated the stock more or less, who were betting on the failure, who had this sort of closed capitalistic system. It was Roaring Kitty against a man. 29:04 He's still for the common people, but I, I have a sense that his enemies will sort of find some sort of loophole to give him a slap on the wrist financially. 29:13 So are you saying that much like the boy becomes the man, the kitty's becoming the cat? [laughs] That, that's a interesting analogy, but I am subtly saying he will become the man. 29:26 I don't wanna go as far as to say, like, people will, will like... 29:31 His audience will see him as sort of the same capitalistic people that they were fighting against because that, that could happen, but I see more the same people that, like Citadel or whoever that was, will find some way to be like, "He's doing the same thing," you know? 29:49 He should start a company just called Kitty Capital. [laughs] Make that a T-shirt. Is that your hot take? That's my hot take. All right. Thank you guys for tuning in. 29:58 It was fun jamming, and, uh, we're gonna catch you next week. Future Forecast. Listen to the pod wherever you get podcasts. Fill out our survey. Subscribe to the newsletter. Peace. 30:14 The Future Forecast is produced by Wheelhouse DNA for Acast. Our executive producers are me, Boye Kolade, along with Fanny Baudry, Cassie Berman, and Leah Sutherland. Our audio producer is Kiara Anoni. 30:27 Our audio engineer is Matthew Blocka. Our editor is Nick Kursiemy. The podcast is hosted by yours truly, Boye Kolade, and Chris Sawtelle. Thanks for listening, and see you next time. 30:38 [upbeat music] Hey, we're Nick and Jack, hosts of The Best One Yet. Behind every episode, there's research, emails, spreadsheets, and our shared Google Doc, the Headline Hammer. 30:50 With Google Workspace with Gemini, Google's AI is built right into the premium versions of tools we already use, like Gmail, Docs, and Sheets. No new tools or extra logins, just personalized AI for the way we work. 31:01 That means less time on the work around the work, and more time finding the stories worth talking about. Get AI tools for work. Upgrade to Google Workspace with Gemini at goo.gle/workspacewithgemini. 31:13 That's goo.gle/workspacewithgemini. This show is brought to you by The Future Party and Crossix Studios, produced by Chris Sawtelle, Boye Kolade, and Paul York. 31:25 Special shout-out to our production team, Araceli Rubalcava, Max Schoolen, Shannon Klein, and Eli Tafur. [upbeat music]
